Bad Matchmaking Thread

50456879


HAZE smurf+cheat
PAIGE smurf ? + inparty with haze

HIGH probability -- haze+paige creating Illegal software, suing one-day lifetime accounts.

Wraith -- left the match, because she suspected ally haze in cheats. Plus, she were outplayed in melee+parry combat by me -- me is Mina

Green leaving label
PLEASE, DisBan wraith account " xKUDISx "

Wraith left first, disban this acc, ama begging.
 
50457089

Another terribly matchmade game. What's worse is that you take the L all the same regardless of whether you performed or not. I'm sure at this point that this thread is just a place for people to vent. Valve has the tech to automatically parse games and see whether they are poorly matchmade or not.
 
50459552

Infernus abandons the game after his lane gets obliterated like 8 minutes into the game with Seven following too. I find it difficult to understand how they let "matchmaking" give us such bad games. I think there's enough examples of the system simply not working, will just wait until some patch deals with it.
 
Valve literally does not care. They have left every game they have ever made be ruined by cheaters. Deadlock will be the same.

Every low to mid rank match will have cheaters or smurfs in them.

It is going to be fixed.

Look at AI bots! There are HUGE intelecccc.

The only thing that must be done -- unban player who rage-quit ed, and saved other TIME of 11 humans...

Look at first 2 minutes as me to wraith, and wraith to me. WRAITH didn't understand that parry+melee has lags on server (ping ms lag) - i parryed her 3 time in a row - BOOM. In wraith's mid "AUTOPERRY HACK, AUTOPERRY HACK". But i was lucky, and ping betrayed Wraith+Doorman combat. !

Thats it, videogame is juicy! In addition, our infernus voiced and claimed dirtyness of haze player, on the opposite line.


P.S. waiting for 4 lines plus 6 players (true-solo, true skill) on that map. Fun per hour was extreme! in nonpopular casual mode, i was happy to lend a surprising hand of help to an unknown wanderer, using only (70% game-pings for micro, 20% chat for macro, 10% voice for anti-conflict question solutions). 90% Humans still have 0.1% clue, that during death, ping on mini-map is seen by alive ALLY. Verdict - they skippppp tutorial with length of 30 secs. They don't know about tom clancy's rainbow six siege, with game after virtual death. They have catastrophic habit to press alt+tab after ingamedeath during playing game.

 

Analysis: Party Matchmaking Is Broken and How To Fix It​


SUMMARY

At lower ranks, matchmaking is biased towards solo and duo queue players. Data from 158 matches shows a clear bias. I assume the opposite is true in higher ranks, but that exceeds the scope of this analysis.

METHODOLOGY

I pulled my last 158 games from statlocker. I used statlocker because it quickly displays party size. I ignored games where someone abandoned. I did not analyze more games, because it reached back to when statlocker was having difficulty pulling match data, leading to many incomplete matches.


RESULTS
Solo: 17/26 wins (65% winrate)
Duo: 42/75 wins (56% winrate)
Trio: 15/46 wins (33% winrate)
4-stack: 3/11 wins (27% winrate)

DISCUSSION

My account is currently ranked in low Archon. I've been as high as Archon 6 when I solo queue, but every time I play with my friends, matchmaking insists I lose. Having a 30% winrate for party queue is not healthy or fun. I've been steadily improving and am outperforming my account's rank (65% winrate) but not ranking up because of losses in a party. My lower rank friends don't even want to queue with me if I'm on a win streak, because all of us feel the massive change in difficulty when we party up.

I had the same issue with Smite. I was a Masters level player and regularly queued casual games with my friends who were much lower rank. The games felt the same as in Deadlock, where you are likely using the same matchmaking algorithm (or similar). My games queued in party are exceptionally and noticeably more challenging.

I think there's an assumption that the more players are in a party, the stronger that party is. This is likely true at the highest level, but it flips on its head when you get to lower than average rank. The alchemist and arcanist games I play in party are massively more challenging than my solo queue archon games. The individual lane opponents are often phantom or oracle players (2 full ranks above my account) while my random teammates have no clue how to play.

SOLUTION

The simplest and cleanest solution is to have unique matchmaking for individual parties. When I play regularly with my 3-stack and 4-stack, the game should assign a unique rank to the party, not individual players. It should remember this rank and apply it every time we queue together. Wins and losses should not apply to our individual accounts/ranks.

How this would look:

I queue with my friends for the first time. Our ranks are Initiate, Seeker, Ritualist, and Archon. The game averages our rank to treat us as four fresh accounts ranked somewhere around Arcanist. Conversely, treat us as 4 solo queue players for the first match matchmaking.

After that match finishes, adjust that Arcanist rank based on the win/loss and then treat that as our rank going forward. So next weekend we queue together, and the algorithm treats us as 4 arcanist players.

As we win/lose, our collective rank will rise/lower to meet an approximate 50% winrate. At this point, matchmaking will have done its job and found balance. Even if I climb to Eternus or fall to Initiate, matchmaking will strive to keep our 4 stack at 50% winrate, as opposed to the current 27% winrate. This will create a better experience for all 12 players in the lobby.

KNOWN PROBLEMS WITH MY METHODOLOGY/CLARIFICATIONS

158 games is a small sample size. 11 games as a 4-stack is an even smaller sample size. However, my group has been feeling this problem for the past year.

Individual characters have individual hidden MMR. I did not account for that in my analysis. However, most of my games with lower MMR characters have been losses in 4-stack or 3-stack games, because the current algorithm strives to put me on lower individual MMR characters when I queue into lower average MMR lobbies. The result is that when I'm in a 4-stack, I'm on a weaker character, and as I result I have even less impact, making the match that much harder to carry (which the algorithm expects of me as the highest rank player on my team).

Smurfs exist, and I know some of my losses were to smurfs. When I 4-stack I'm less likely to get a smurf on my side, though (2 possible teammates as smurfs versus 5 if I solo queue).

Many of these games were during the holiday challenge. I'm sure many players were not on their main characters.

THAT'S IT. PLEASE FIX SO MY FRIENDS CAN ENJOY PLAYING THE GAME WITH ME AGAIN.
If you are the highest rank in your group and playing with a 4 stack, you have control of the macro of over half of your team. If that is leading to a 27% WR, you either have terrible macro or your buddies mechanical skills are so bad they need to stick to Roblox or no build Fortnite.

MM in this game is terrible but I find it hard to believe that your 4 stack is consistently being put against a team that has a significantly higher rank than you all's average or that there is 3+ Oracle/Phantom players on the other team that outrank you.
 
50459552

Infernus abandons the game after his lane gets obliterated like 8 minutes into the game with Seven following too. I find it difficult to understand how they let "matchmaking" give us such bad games. I think there's enough examples of the system simply not working, will just wait until some patch deals with it.
50461980

And literally again, same issue. Done posting these until MM is updated. Tempted to just alt like all these others are doing, getting such low quality games on your main account just adds so much friction to ranking up.
 

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Use this thread to share matchids for games that you think the matchmaker did a bad job at. If you can explain what you felt was a problem in it that would be helpful as well.

Do not post matchids for games that were within the past 24 hours from this post. Games older than that are fine and games going forward are fine.

Thanks for the help
50464376: I did well but my team got stomped. Also, I'm in Seeker 3 and this is an Initiate 2 lobby. It feels like it was balanced around me being a much higher rank than my team, so our opponents were far better than my teammates.
 
50471978

Legitimately one of the worst matches I've ever played. We did not get a single guardian.
The Victor and Bebop are obviously cheating or smurfing, destroying the entire lobby without zero effort.

I know the dev team doesn't read this thread but this game experience sucks so much, man. Nobody I know wants to play the game anymore because it's so unfun to play against smurfs.
 
50471978

Legitimately one of the worst matches I've ever played. We did not get a single guardian.
The Victor and Bebop are obviously cheating or smurfing, destroying the entire lobby without zero effort.

I know the dev team doesn't read this thread but this game experience sucks so much, man. Nobody I know wants to play the game anymore because it's so unfun to play against smurfs.
Not gonna lie this section of a forums is 1:1 as in any other FPS game.

People just want to win all the time... well guess what if that would be the case someone would be losing all the time and then they would come and post stuff in this forums :)

The fact that games are not like super close especially in game like deadlock where you can snowball a few minor mistakes / skill gap into an easy win I think is ok. As long as you don't get totally destroyed = game is over in like 10 minutes with you / team giving their best, teamworking and still losing super badly.

In most cases from posts above I actually think this is not too bad. Plus game is still in Beta.

As for smurfing and hacking = well that's the issue Valve will have to solve via moderation, anti-cheat, invite only approach as people will keep cheating and smurfing the question that makes or breaks is how much and what is percentage / how community can clean them up or ignore / put in cheaters vs cheaters lobbies.
See Apex, they fail at it for like 5 years now and top players in ranked are mostly hackers.

Gladly in deadlock I seen not too much benefit of aimbotting but wallhack / radar would for sure make or break the game giving significant advantage and again matchmaking would not be able to fix it as in many cases those hackers just drop X games to look like nubs just to go all out and stomp the next game to pleasure themselves...
Same goes with "weak" actually legit top gamers who as in Apex become tired of grinding, working hard for their streaming money and request matchmaking that feeds them way lower ELO players or worse create new accounts and do those X to Y runs stomping so many low ELO players along the way.

Creating some closed invite only communities that are all for legit competitions that are moderated, managed and active enough to keep interest is the key, hope deadlock will have something like this aka ability to create 3rd party custom games, tournaments, alternative ranked systems.
 
@Yoshi If I can't report these apes for griefing without my reporting being taken away and also can't call them the retards they are, what is the solution? How about we do a big funny where we delete the game from their hard drive and don't allow them to reinstall it because of their incompetence! Would vastly improve other players experiences!

1767904497080.jpeg
 
If you are the highest rank in your group and playing with a 4 stack, you have control of the macro of over half of your team. If that is leading to a 27% WR, you either have terrible macro or your buddies mechanical skills are so bad they need to stick to Roblox or no build Fortnite.
Let's assume you're correct and we're all awful. Then matchmaking should be putting us in easier matches with better teammates/worse opponents so that we get closer to a 50% winrate.

What is your rank and how does your winrate change when you solo/duo versus 3/4 stack? I would love to see more data.

MM in this game is terrible but I find it hard to believe that your 4 stack is consistently being put against a team that has a significantly higher rank than you all's average or that there is 3+ Oracle/Phantom players on the other team that outrank you.

This isn't about faith. I've posted my statlocker. Do you have any data to add to the discussion? If I'm wrong, a more robust data set should show that.
 
Every mate leave on the start, but match was scored. So we lose it 2 vs 5 in 6 minutes rly? There was a red banner, who tald me "if u leave its scored lose for u", so why? If 4 peoples in my team leave before match started? id: 502589481767912728423.png
 
50498667
Calico Gun build literally has name NEGATIVE WINRATE
TALON and Dynamo wasting ult

I lost 2 ranks for this single game was on winning spree 5+ before excluding the bot practice game I played a game before were better than these human players
 

Analysis: Party Matchmaking Is Broken and How To Fix It​


SUMMARY

At lower ranks, matchmaking is biased towards solo and duo queue players. Data from 158 matches shows a clear bias. I assume the opposite is true in higher ranks, but that exceeds the scope of this analysis.

METHODOLOGY

I pulled my last 158 games from statlocker. I used statlocker because it quickly displays party size. I ignored games where someone abandoned. I did not analyze more games, because it reached back to when statlocker was having difficulty pulling match data, leading to many incomplete matches.


RESULTS
Solo: 17/26 wins (65% winrate)
Duo: 42/75 wins (56% winrate)
Trio: 15/46 wins (33% winrate)
4-stack: 3/11 wins (27% winrate)

DISCUSSION

My account is currently ranked in low Archon. I've been as high as Archon 6 when I solo queue, but every time I play with my friends, matchmaking insists I lose. Having a 30% winrate for party queue is not healthy or fun. I've been steadily improving and am outperforming my account's rank (65% winrate) but not ranking up because of losses in a party. My lower rank friends don't even want to queue with me if I'm on a win streak, because all of us feel the massive change in difficulty when we party up.

I had the same issue with Smite. I was a Masters level player and regularly queued casual games with my friends who were much lower rank. The games felt the same as in Deadlock, where you are likely using the same matchmaking algorithm (or similar). My games queued in party are exceptionally and noticeably more challenging.

I think there's an assumption that the more players are in a party, the stronger that party is. This is likely true at the highest level, but it flips on its head when you get to lower than average rank. The alchemist and arcanist games I play in party are massively more challenging than my solo queue archon games. The individual lane opponents are often phantom or oracle players (2 full ranks above my account) while my random teammates have no clue how to play.

SOLUTION

The simplest and cleanest solution is to have unique matchmaking for individual parties. When I play regularly with my 3-stack and 4-stack, the game should assign a unique rank to the party, not individual players. It should remember this rank and apply it every time we queue together. Wins and losses should not apply to our individual accounts/ranks.

How this would look:

I queue with my friends for the first time. Our ranks are Initiate, Seeker, Ritualist, and Archon. The game averages our rank to treat us as four fresh accounts ranked somewhere around Arcanist. Conversely, treat us as 4 solo queue players for the first match matchmaking.

After that match finishes, adjust that Arcanist rank based on the win/loss and then treat that as our rank going forward. So next weekend we queue together, and the algorithm treats us as 4 arcanist players.

As we win/lose, our collective rank will rise/lower to meet an approximate 50% winrate. At this point, matchmaking will have done its job and found balance. Even if I climb to Eternus or fall to Initiate, matchmaking will strive to keep our 4 stack at 50% winrate, as opposed to the current 27% winrate. This will create a better experience for all 12 players in the lobby.

KNOWN PROBLEMS WITH MY METHODOLOGY/CLARIFICATIONS

158 games is a small sample size. 11 games as a 4-stack is an even smaller sample size. However, my group has been feeling this problem for the past year.

Individual characters have individual hidden MMR. I did not account for that in my analysis. However, most of my games with lower MMR characters have been losses in 4-stack or 3-stack games, because the current algorithm strives to put me on lower individual MMR characters when I queue into lower average MMR lobbies. The result is that when I'm in a 4-stack, I'm on a weaker character, and as I result I have even less impact, making the match that much harder to carry (which the algorithm expects of me as the highest rank player on my team).

Smurfs exist, and I know some of my losses were to smurfs. When I 4-stack I'm less likely to get a smurf on my side, though (2 possible teammates as smurfs versus 5 if I solo queue).

Many of these games were during the holiday challenge. I'm sure many players were not on their main characters.

THAT'S IT. PLEASE FIX SO MY FRIENDS CAN ENJOY PLAYING THE GAME WITH ME AGAIN.
We both know Valve doesn't have enough computational bandwidth for your solution let alone even have enough for good enough matchmaking as several posts here have shown us
Common problem in party is often who has the best highest rank and the better average rank/skilled players and the excuse is its alpha/beta
 
Shit game @Yoshi the usual dribble matchmaking. Didn't get the priority character I picked and the person on my team that got it didn't use half the skill but made up for it with the poor plays and feed to the other team. Slow claps all round!

...fyi because I'm guessing you devs don't realise but that is sarcasm.
 
Thanks for penalizing player for dodging bad players and matches. Make no sense when the matchmaking is shit and I have to play the game 3times harder and carry 3 or 4 babies just to win.
1767944964094.png
I got the same duo next game (vin + shiv), I dodged and now I can't play the game for 24 hours and gets put into low priority lobby? What the hell? Why am I getting punished for not wanting an uneven match?

And if this shit match making puts me in a lobby where I have to play the game FOR my teammate and makes me want to dodge, what's low priority lobby going to like? 1vs6??
 
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