Some Item reworks

[Nayurian]

Healing Nova:
Active is now a passive with the same CD, and the text "When you heal/shield yourself or an ally a healing aura will occur healing all nearby allies." Stats and values stay the same. (I think the item has no value as an item since counteritems are way stronger then some healing in this game)
Healing Tempo:
Now also procs with shields.
Healing beam:
Now gives movespeed instead of sprint speed
Metal skin:
Cd now 30 sec but protect you from bullets in general, not procing items or passives that are connected to hitting bullets.
Healing Regeneration:
First passive now also procs when healing or shielding teammates
Spirit burn:
Does not apply on minions anymore (Feels horrible when you push lane and it procs on minion when you get attacked right after you don´t have it ready. Maybe buff it in other parts if it loses to much value)

 

[gibnewitems]

Healing Nova:
Active is now a passive with the same CD, and the text "When you heal/shield yourself or an ally a healing aura will occur healing all nearby allies." Stats and values stay the same. (I think the item has no value as an item since counteritems are way stronger then some healing in this game)

Healing nova is fine as is, and turning it into a passive doesn't really do much to change it's interactions with heal cut. Probably better off turning this into a new item.

Healing Tempo:
Now also procs with shields.

IDK. Maybe? Could be a little broken on Paige.

Healing beam:
Now gives movespeed instead of sprint speed

Fair, but Rescue beam is already in a solid state.

Metal skin:
Cd now 30 sec but protect you from bullets in general, not procing items or passives that are connected to hitting bullets.

This just loops metal skin back to being incredibly broken and cements capacitor into being even more of a must-buy item. This got changed long ago for a pretty good reason.

Healing Regeneration:
First passive now also procs when healing or shielding teammates

Assuming this is radiant regeneration (since it's the only two passive item with regeneration in it's name), why? It literally says "dealing spirit damage to enemy heroes".

Spirit burn:
Does not apply on minions anymore (Feels horrible when you push lane and it procs on minion when you get attacked right after you don´t have it ready. Maybe buff it in other parts if it loses to much value)

Agreed. This item only got changed because of one hero, that's just ridiculous.

 

[Nayurian]

Healing nova is fine as is, and turning it into a passive doesn't really do much to change it's interactions with heal cut. Probably better off turning this into a new item.

I´m fine with that idea of making a new item, with this passive. My problem with healing nova is that I can never buy it on a support since all my active items are used by debuffs like slowing hex, dissarming hex, knockdown or similar stuff that is much more needed that a small healing so I think the current healing nova is redundant and never used. But as I said I don´t mind making a new item healing explosion as a passive.

 

[Nayurian]

IDK. Maybe? Could be a little broken on Paige.

I don´t think it would be, Paige isn´t that good anyway in current game, she might become stronger with that but compared to other characters there is still room for her. I think there need to be more items for healers and shielders.

Fair, but Rescue beam is already in a solid state.

That is true, I just don´t like the idea of sprint on a support and think movement wouldn´t break it. Also I don´t know which rank you are but after the changes I play in oracle and people still don´t play support so there has to be something really wrong with the role that nobody considers going for the items and instead go dmg. Supports need to have more impact and giving them some better stats would help

This just loops metal skin back to being incredibly broken and cements capacitor into being even more of a must-buy item. This got changed long ago for a pretty good reason.

Oh I didn´t know that, the current metal skin seems useless tho, you get slowed and haze still shoots you down with all her passive item dmg so the item has no use, if it can´t be buffed then rework it completly.

Assuming this is radiant regeneration (since it's the only two passive item with regeneration in it's name), why? It literally says "dealing spirit damage to enemy heroes".

Because adding it to work with healers and shielders doesn´t make the item stronger, it simple gives more characters the ability to buy it. All characters that buy it now can´t heal or shield, so it changes nothing for them. But with that change all supports would have a new regeneration item to use for themself. therefor the item strenght stays the same, but more characters can make use of it which I always welcome in mobas. I don´t want to remove the part that dealing spirit dmg activates the passive, I just added something so healers and shielders could also buy it if needed.

Agreed. This item only got changed because of one hero, that's just ridiculous.

Yes I understand why they changed it, but the way they did it made it really awful to use, so it needs changes fast

 

[gibnewitems]

I´m fine with that idea of making a new item, with this passive. My problem with healing nova is that I can never buy it on a support since all my active items are used by debuffs like slowing hex, dissarming hex, knockdown or similar stuff that is much more needed that a small healing so I think the current healing nova is redundant and never used. But as I said I don´t mind making a new item healing explosion as a passive.

Thing is, this version of nova hurts heroes like Dynamo (who i tend to play a lot). While I don't always go for a heal build (especially after the stomp buffs), healing nova is very appreciated for providing me a second aoe heal that also procs healing tempo on my teammates. It's useful when aurora is on cooldown. With the reworked passive nova, I lose out on another way to proc tempo on my whole team, have to use aurora to proc it, and my teammates potentially have half the tempo uptime duration within a fight.

While passive nova might save an active slot, it takes away a cheap and easy way to proc tempo on a whole team. Even heroes with aoe healing in their kit would rather have the active variant for the increased tempo uptime.

 

[Nayurian]

Thing is, this version of nova hurts heroes like Dynamo (who i tend to play a lot). While I don't always go for a heal build (especially after the stomp buffs), healing nova is very appreciated for providing me a second aoe heal that also procs healing tempo on my teammates. It's useful when aurora is on cooldown. With the reworked passive nova, I lose out on another way to proc tempo on my whole team, have to use aurora to proc it, and my teammates potentially have half the tempo uptime duration within a fight.

While passive nova might save an active slot, it takes away a cheap and easy way to proc tempo on a whole team. Even heroes with aoe healing in their kit would rather have the active variant for the increased tempo uptime.

I understand that, I like to play dynamo aswell and that´s why I´m trying to make some usefull support items. You can´t know it, but I´m also actively pushing for dynamo healing to be on lower CD, same for paige shield. I think that would fix the uptime problem of healing tempo and other similar effect for future support items. I rather have them lower the heal a little bit but have it on a lower cd so that item uptimes synergize better.

 

[Nayurian]

honestly I think just lowering the dynamo heal cd would work they didn´t need to nerf the heal since it´s already pretty low to beginn with compared to heals in other mobas. I would suggest to lower dynamo heal cd by 10-15 sec. that would fix item uptime for healing tempo aswell

 

[Nayurian]

when it comes to dynamo I suggested a lot of things, for example the 2 ability to give resist to bullet and/or spirit instead of fire rate. healing cd being lower, dmg on 1 having less spirit scaling and that would fix a lot of things without making him broken

 

[gibnewitems]

I understand that, I like to play dynamo aswell and that´s why I´m trying to make some usefull support items. You can´t know it, but I´m also actively pushing for dynamo healing to be on lower CD, same for paige shield. I think that would fix the uptime problem of healing tempo and other similar effect for future support items. I rather have them lower the heal a little bit but have it on a lower cd so that item uptimes synergize better.

honestly I think just lowering the dynamo heal cd would work they didn´t need to nerf the heal since it´s already pretty low to beginn with compared to heals in other mobas. I would suggest to lower dynamo heal cd by 10-15 sec. that would fix item uptime for healing tempo aswell

I don't think this is a good idea to be honest. Aurora gets pretty low, like 24s low when maxed out and building CDR as well. Any lower, and Dynamo would probably have to get a couple nerfs to his other abilities to compensate. Dynamo isn't just a healer, and probably shouldn't have to receive a whole bunch of nerfs to his initiator/nuker side of his kit to prop up his ability to healbot.

If we are going to give Dynamo buffs, it should be small and more geared toward his damage/lockdown potential.

for example the 2 ability to give resist to bullet and/or spirit instead of fire rate.

It gives fire rate because it's duration is tied to next reload and it gives part of your fire rate buff to teammates. Outside of gun dynamo (which should absolutely get some buffs IMO), quantum is usually used to dodge abilities and CC. resists don't really matter when you can already reduce the damage to zero.

I've already said enough about lower heal CD in my previous paragraph.

dmg on 1 having less spirit scaling

Unless you give him far higher base dmg on stomp, this would be quite a massive nerf. Decent scaling is all that stomp has. It's slow, requires a lot more investment that other nuking abilities, and can be dodged pretty easily.

 

[AleksiyFlek$$iy]

Healing Nova:
Active is now a passive with the same CD, and the text "When you heal/shield yourself or an ally a healing aura will occur healing all nearby allies." Stats and values stay the same

You're trying to save a slot for actives, but lose something much meaningful for that — controllability.

(I think the item has no value as an item since counteritems are way stronger then some healing in this game)

I dare to say, that external healing is the weakest things in the game, mainly because it is external and how easy it can be wasted by your allies.

Healing Tempo:
Now also procs with shields.

Now it's a Shielding Tempo. Jokes aside, I think there should be a different item for that.

Healing beam:
Now gives movespeed instead of sprint speed

I can agree on that, but the change is super-minor, won't change something in practice.

Metal skin:
Cd now 30 sec but protect you from bullets in general, not procing items or passives that are connected to hitting bullets.

We have now Plated Armor for that.

Healing Regeneration:
First passive now also procs when healing or shielding teammates

I think that idea deserves its own unique item. That item could heal you for percent of healing granted by you. Of course it won't work with self-healing.

Spirit burn:
Does not apply on minions anymore (Feels horrible when you push lane and it procs on minion when you get attacked right after you don´t have it ready. Maybe buff it in other parts if it loses to much value)

This is a much better change than the one we got.

 

[Nayurian]

I don't think this is a good idea to be honest. Aurora gets pretty low, like 24s low when maxed out and building CDR as well. Any lower, and Dynamo would probably have to get a couple nerfs to his other abilities to compensate. Dynamo isn't just a healer, and probably shouldn't have to receive a whole bunch of nerfs to his initiator/nuker side of his kit to prop up his ability to healbot.

If we are going to give Dynamo buffs, it should be small and more geared toward his damage/lockdown potential.

It gives fire rate because it's duration is tied to next reload and it gives part of your fire rate buff to teammates. Outside of gun dynamo (which should absolutely get some buffs IMO), quantum is usually used to dodge abilities and CC. resists don't really matter when you can already reduce the damage to zero.

I've already said enough about lower heal CD in my previous paragraph.


Unless you give him far higher base dmg on stomp, this would be quite a massive nerf. Decent scaling is all that stomp has. It's slow, requires a lot more investment that other nuking abilities, and can be dodged pretty easily.

I think we just have different visions for dynamo which is totally ok and I guess the devs have to decide the direction.
I think his dmg should not be buffed if anything they could nerf his 1 scaling to make more room for utility.
Lower healinc cd would be totally fine, I don´t think with how fast the game is having a 14 sec heal could be problematic, other mobas have much lower heal cd and it isn´t a problem.
His lockdown is already one of the best, but if anything I could see some buffs to his 1 ability in that department.
I don´t want him to be a healbot but a proper support, maybe even tank support since his abilitys look like he should be in the middle of the fight, I had also suggested to the devs to change his 1 ability to instead be a wave that pulses arround him instead of a line.
his 3 ability can dodge one spell but most of the time your teammates are still in a bad situation and benefit from resistance more then fire rate which half of your team might barely even use to deal dmg.
I don´t see the reason to have dmg dynamo as the priority when we have all the other characters aside page focused on dealing dmg. I think he should be viable but making his support trash just to have dmg dynamo would be the wrong approach atleast for me

 

[Nayurian]

You're trying to save a slot for actives, but lose something much meaningful for that — controllability.


I dare to say, that external healing is the weakest things in the game, mainly because it is external and how easy it can be wasted by your allies.


Now it's a Shielding Tempo. Jokes aside, I think there should be a different item for that.


I can agree on that, but the change is super-minor, won't change something in practice.


We have now Plated Armor for that.


I think that idea deserves its own unique item. That item could heal you for percent of healing granted by you. Of course it won't work with self-healing.


This is a much better change than the one we got.

they could create a new item as you suggested

 

[砂糖菓子]

Healing Nova:
Active is now a passive with the same CD, and the text "When you heal/shield yourself or an ally a healing aura will occur healing all nearby allies." Stats and values stay the same. (I think the item has no value as an item since counteritems are way stronger then some healing in this game)

My idea is to grant the Healing Novaa new passive:when you are above 75%HP，your healing boost.