What do players really want?

alyimoff

New member
1. character transforming into others (morphling / echo)
2. character in controlled robot (timbersaw / d.va)
3. short comic character ( sniper / torbjorn)
4. more characters that do NOT shoot bullets (like grey talon or alt yamato)
5. characters with references (in design or gameplay) to previous Valve games
6. characters with realistic weapons (like in CS)
valve please!
 
1. character transforming into others (morphling / echo)
2. character in controlled robot (timbersaw / d.va)
3. short comic character ( sniper / torbjorn)
4. more characters that do NOT shoot bullets (like grey talon or alt yamato)
5. characters with references (in design or gameplay) to previous Valve games
6. characters with realistic weapons (like in CS)
valve please!
I think 5 would be nice
 
1. character transforming into others (morphling / echo)
2. character in controlled robot (timbersaw / d.va)
3. short comic character ( sniper / torbjorn)
4. more characters that do NOT shoot bullets (like grey talon or alt yamato)
5. characters with references (in design or gameplay) to previous Valve games
6. characters with realistic weapons (like in CS)
valve please!

Notice that most of these suggestions play on common tropes within the genre, as you pointed out by referencing preexisting characters from other titles.

Deadlock should not conform to the genre's current tropes. Deadlock has a strong, unique aesthetic through its noir-inspired take on a world that's a blend of the familiar and the supernatural. Referencing previous titles, implementing "realistic weapons", and so on would contradict the intention of a unique world. I do think 1 and 3 are viable suggestions that could be implemented into this title's world but I would rather trust the designers to give us characters that are expressions of their vision rather than common tropes.

As a personal note, I haven't liked exceptionally short characters in shooters since Oddjob in Goldeneye on the N64 and gnomes in PvP from World of Warcraft. Maybe some sort of gremlin or imp that fits the game world would grow on me, but man, these characters have to be made fun to compensate for their annoying hurtboxes.
 
Deadlock should not conform to the genre's current tropes.
It already has. Bebop is Blitzcrank/Pudge/Roadhog. Lady Geist is Vladimir with a Terrorblade Ult. Vindicta is Widowmaker/Caitlyn/Sniper. Grey Talon is Hanzo. McGinnis is Heimerdinger/Torbjorn/TF2 Engineer. Abrams is Reinhardt. Haze has a Samira/Reaper ult.
All the heroes already use recognizable abilities and playing styles from both the moba genre and hero shooters. And that's not a bad thing. These tropes exist because people like playing them.
In a way, Deadlock has an advantage; the devs can just mix and match different abilities from different pre-existing games with hero rosters. And it's even funnier considering Icefrog more-or-less started this whole trend anyway.
 
Notice that most of these suggestions play on common tropes within the genre, as you pointed out by referencing preexisting characters from other titles.

Deadlock should not conform to the genre's current tropes. Deadlock has a strong, unique aesthetic through its noir-inspired take on a world that's a blend of the familiar and the supernatural. Referencing previous titles, implementing "realistic weapons", and so on would contradict the intention of a unique world. I do think 1 and 3 are viable suggestions that could be implemented into this title's world but I would rather trust the designers to give us characters that are expressions of their vision rather than common tropes.

As a personal note, I haven't liked exceptionally short characters in shooters since Oddjob in Goldeneye on the N64 and gnomes in PvP from World of Warcraft. Maybe some sort of gremlin or imp that fits the game world would grow on me, but man, these characters have to be made fun to compensate for their annoying hurtboxes.
1 and 4 are gameplay suggestions
2 a steam robot/mech would fit perfectly into the deadlock concept (Considering that there are McGins with fairly advanced turrets)
6 Wraith already has a Thompson submachine gun, it would be funny if there was a character with a deagle or an ak47
The problem of the dwarf character's hitbox can be solved by combining points 2 and 3
 
1 and 4 are gameplay suggestions
2 a steam robot/mech would fit perfectly into the deadlock concept (Considering that there are McGins with fairly advanced turrets)
6 Wraith already has a Thompson submachine gun, it would be funny if there was a character with a deagle or an ak47
The problem of the dwarf character's hitbox can be solved by combining points 2 and 3

I recognized 1 and 3 as being viable, with 4 being unmentioned since it was blatantly obvious as something already executed in the game (and something I also like).


It already has. Bebop is Blitzcrank/Pudge/Roadhog. Lady Geist is Vladimir with a Terrorblade Ult. Vindicta is Widowmaker/Caitlyn/Sniper. Grey Talon is Hanzo. McGinnis is Heimerdinger/Torbjorn/TF2 Engineer. Abrams is Reinhardt. Haze has a Samira/Reaper ult.
All the heroes already use recognizable abilities and playing styles from both the moba genre and hero shooters. And that's not a bad thing. These tropes exist because people like playing them.
In a way, Deadlock has an advantage; the devs can just mix and match different abilities from different pre-existing games with hero rosters. And it's even funnier considering Icefrog more-or-less started this whole trend anyway.

You're right. It was quite late when I made my reply and I'm not as good at all-nighters as I used to be so I was pretty foggy, so my thoughts and wording were equally scrambled. A lot of the times when I'm playing Deadlock I find myself gushing over how the game combines some of my favorite aspects of Dota 2 with the hero genre so I'm pretty cognizant of the tropes it plays on.

Having said that, gamplay-wise, I don't think it's entirely fair to relate Vindicta, Grey Talon, McGinnis, and Abrams to their counterparts in other titles. Their gameplay is wildly different. Grey Talon's weapon barely functions the way a typical bow would with a completely different kit from Hanzo, Vindicta does not have the same effective range as characters like Widowmaker and Sniper, Abrams lacks the conal slam and Reinhardt's most notable ability, his shield, and McGinnis is so vastly different in how she utilizes turrets compared to Torbjorn and Heimer especially. Conceptually they follow the trope, gameplay-wise they're fairly unique.

One of the nice things about Deadlock is that its movement options allow characters to feel further unique from their counterparts in other games. Vindicta's super jump, heavy melee canceling with characters like Abrams, and so on further allow characters to feel unique when their abilities emphasize these movements. But, yes, there are a lot of recognizable abilities and I agree that it's not a bad thing.

I think aesthetically my thought process is that I think it would be a shame if the character roster ended up being Deadlock's take on the same base roster every other hero shooter has, and gameplay-wise, it'd be stale if too many characters feel generic in their mechanics. Viscous, Yamato, Shiv, and Paradox offer really unique takes on existant tropes thanks to the game's physics, and Lash, Mirage, and Pocket are examples of characters who might share abilities with characters from other games but feel largely like their own iteration.

But I'm also an idiot, so.
 
1 and 4 are gameplay suggestions
2 a steam robot/mech would fit perfectly into the deadlock concept (Considering that there are McGins with fairly advanced turrets)
6 Wraith already has a Thompson submachine gun, it would be funny if there was a character with a deagle or an ak47
The problem of the dwarf character's hitbox can be solved by combining points 2 and 3

Also double posting because I don't see the ability to edit my reply for some reason but I wanted to say that "notice how..." seems really snarky but I didn't mean for it to. Sorry if I ever came across as condescending or rude, it wasn't intentional or reflective of how I actually feel.
 
1. character transforming into others (morphling / echo)
2. character in controlled robot (timbersaw / d.va)
3. short comic character ( sniper / torbjorn)
4. more characters that do NOT shoot bullets (like grey talon or alt yamato)
5. characters with references (in design or gameplay) to previous Valve games
6. characters with realistic weapons (like in CS)
valve please!

we got an ambassador here
 
4. more characters that do NOT shoot bullets (like grey talon or alt yamato)

6. characters with realistic weapons (like in CS)
 
Having said that, gamplay-wise, I don't think it's entirely fair to relate Vindicta, Grey Talon, McGinnis, and Abrams to their counterparts in other titles. Their gameplay is wildly different.
Well, yeah. They can't just copy paste other heroes into the game. That's a lawsuit waiting to happen.

But I agree with everything else you said. I believe the uniqueness of its heroes visual and gameplay design comes from the innate blend of the two genres: the shooter and the moba. The character designs more-or-less asks "what if this overwatch hero was a moba hero?" and "what if this moba hero was a third person shooter?" And the answers they come up with inherently make the hero unique and distinct from its initial counterparts because of the cross-genre translation. That's my theory/take on it anyway.

Although, I do find it funny that deadlock's way of distinguishing Bebop from his moba/hero shooter counterparts is to give him a straight up Vel'Koz laser as an ultimate. Not complaining. I just think it's funny
 
1. character transforming into others (morphling / echo)
2. character in controlled robot (timbersaw / d.va)
3. short comic character ( sniper / torbjorn)
4. more characters that do NOT shoot bullets (like grey talon or alt yamato)
5. characters with references (in design or gameplay) to previous Valve games
6. characters with realistic weapons (like in CS)
valve please!
I want a cleanse character that can remove / prevent DOTs and Debuffs since there seems to be no other answer to Shiv / Infernus outside of an expensive item.
 
Everything is fine bro
Also double posting because I don't see the ability to edit my reply for some reason but I wanted to say that "notice how..." seems really snarky but I didn't mean for it to. Sorry if I ever came across as condescending or rude, it wasn't intentional or reflective of how I actually feel.
 
I want a cleanse character that can remove / prevent DOTs and Debuffs since there seems to be no other answer to Shiv / Infernus outside of an expensive item.

viscous cube removes negative effects, also the dynamo teleport allows you to avoid damage (albeit for a small amount of time)
 
What do you, as a player, want?
Very simple, avoid having OP heroes , like right now DOuble bomb Beebop, shiv, hazeulti. Its really ruins the fun. and yes these might be not an issue in high skill elo, but your majority alyer base will be normal people, so dont make the same mistake dota2 did. Going against OP heroes really makes the game feel terrible
 
Very simple, avoid having OP heroes , like right now DOuble bomb Beebop, shiv, hazeulti. Its really ruins the fun. and yes these might be not an issue in high skill elo, but your majority alyer base will be normal people, so dont make the same mistake dota2 did. Going against OP heroes really makes the game feel terrible
This. You shouldn't balance a game around your top 1 - 3% of players, this is a great way to lose your general player base.

Balance around the lower skill and much larger player base, the top 1% are there for a reason, let them figure out how to deal with stuff.
 
i want more heroes that are challenging to fight against because they bring some aspect of tf2 or fortnite into a moba game

i want more heroes that break the games rules and mess with the physics

like lash or viscous

also i want heroes than i can pressure lanes but also gank and win fights

like seven and warden

like rn i have four heroes that all really scratch a good itch when i play them and feel easy to wrap my head around but almost unlimited ceiling to mastery. i wouldnt mind there one day being a fifth or sixth like that. deadlock is fun because everything valve learned from csgo, dota, and tf2 is perfected and brought together in much more accessible feeling fortnite style gameplay with the laning being somewhat dark souls feeling with dodging objective attacks and using mobility to explore a deceptively huge map
 
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