Replacing Warden's Willpower with an Aerial Glide

Mr.Mindish

Active member
Warden's Willpower is a good ability, and I think it pairs well with Warden regardless of his build. This is moreso a possible alternative ability for him, though it could go on new character.

For Warden, his archetype is an aggressive DPS who overwhelms individual opponents with his flask and cage, and overwhelms grouped teams with a combination of his Ult and gun. In both cases, Warden's Willpower helps him close the gap and reduce potential Spirit Damage he would take, mainly useful for defense against Healbane and improving his general tankiness. It's especially useful for rotating and mowing down people with the Ultimate, since the 35% move speed increase is very strong. However, I wanted to pitch a new ability for Warden that could work with his new design while maintaining the same benefits Willpower grants.

Warden is almost guarenteed to have a cape for his redesign, hinted at by several voice lines in game and the teaser in one of Yamato's art concepts. Despite being referred to a lot, I don't know if it would be relevant to his current ability set (maybe there's a plan to use it in his Ult visually, but right now nothing about Warden could use the cape). Of course, the cape could be scrapped but it seems to be a core aspect of Warden's upcoming visual design.

So, what if Warden was from the Arkham games? Basically, replace his Willpower with an ability that can only be activated in the air, granting Warden the ability to glide using his cape. The sharper his vertical decline, the faster he gets, so Warden could position himself on higher vantage points to get better at diving people at fast speeds, leaning more into his archetype. How generous the glide's movement could be is a different question, since high rotational movement (Holding the A or D keys) could make him way more difficult to hit if he's trying to escape via the rooftops, but making it too stiff makes the ability mostly pointless compared to Willpower.

The idea is for Warden to be better at engaging in fights if he gets the jump on the opponent, but reduces his effectiveness if his positioning is completely grounded. You could still include Spirit Shields gained for a set duration after the glide is activated, though a grounded Move Speed bonus should not be necessary (otherwise it'd be a complete upgrade to Willpower).

In theory, the glide works similar to Willpower, but gives Warden more depth mobility-wise. It improves his ability to rush people down, but now he needs to commit to the rush more then before, as his escape options are much more limited while on a grounded level. He probably shouldn't be able to dash or double-jump while gliding, though I think Wall Jumps could be allowed.

The ability upgrades would mostly be the same as his current ones for Willpower (T1 speed increase, T2 cooldown reduction, T3 Shields Scale with Spirit).
The move can be silenced with Slowing Hex.
Maybe it could be HMC-able, though it's not necessary.
Warden can still shoot, use abilities and active items while gliding. He can channel his Ult too, though I think he shouldn't be able to change his current trajectory while channelling it. Pressing the Glide ability key (2) while gliding would cancel the glide.
Maybe Spirit Power could be increased while gliding, though it might not be necessary. His effectiveness on ground would basically be nerfed, so there could be passive benefits that the ability grants to balance that out, though that is a whole other discussion.
 
I like this idea, warden seems boring(even if decently powerfull) and his willpower is by far his most boring skill. Can his spirit shield basically be turned into passive and be placed as a T2 upgrade with decent scaling(he won`t get the shield until T2 upgrade) to give him something new as a T3 upgrade? Also i am pretty sure they made HMC item exclusive.
 
I did make a concept with an ability like this, but it was a passive that would cost stamina, very different mechanically to yours. The point being that I genuinely thought a Glide ability would fit this game perfectly, so any hero getting it would be a plus for me, even if it's an already Existing hero. Although, I'd like if it still had a defensive component, but that's just the tank addict speaking.
 
Thinking more about the idea, the upgrades could work like this:
T1: Reduce Ability Cooldown by 8 seconds
T2: Allows spirit shields to scale with spirit and adds 100 extra spirit shield health
T3: Increases the Glide's Turn Speed by 50% and increases movement slow resist while gliding by 40%

Perhaps once the glide is cancelled, Warden keeps the spirit shields and move slow resist for a few seconds.
I don't think the Glide cooldown should be too short, since Warden could glide in, do a lot of damage, then find an easy way out once the Glide's cooldown is restored: he should either use it to get in or out.
Can his spirit shield basically be turned into passive and be placed as a T2 upgrade with decent scaling
It's pretty useful for Warden to activate his shields manually, since he can skip past the shield recover cooldown to use shields when he needs them (like react to a Lash stomp, or activate Enchanters Barrier's buffs on a whim). The HMC idea can be ditched, although HM->Fleetfoot->Glide would still work to maintain that mobility.

It's difficult to decide whether it should lean more into tankiness or mobility. Too much of both could make Warden way too obnoxious to fight.
 
Angelic-Martyr-1739309970.png
Sorry to post this as a seperate reply, I don't think I can edit the main post.
This is a more ironed out version of the glide, with an ability sheet to try and visualise it.
There's probably a better alternative to the Bullet Velocity bonus, but the idea is to make it slightly easier to shoot people while gliding.

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The glide would probably move similar to how the gif shows it (though the vertical incline shouldn't be as generous).
 
The concept is cool. I like the workup you made, but I think 32 seconds is a long Cooldown for the ability unless you expect the glide to regularly be going at the max 28m/s speed.

One problem with the idea of the glide is that Warden doesn't inherently have a way of gaining height. Lash's Ground Strike works because he has Grapple. If you want a flying cape style ability, you'll need to build in some way for him to get elevation into the ability since he doesn't have anything else in his kit to do so.
 
I think 32 seconds is a long Cooldown for the ability unless you expect the glide to regularly be going at the max 28m/s speed.
It is pretty long, but Warden could jump off a zipline/rooftop and glide to a different lane in seconds. The mobility is grants is situational, but still pretty strong. It could be shorter, or even use charges, but it's hard to know how much that could be abused.
One problem with the idea of the glide is that Warden doesn't inherently have a way of gaining height. Lash's Ground Strike works because he has Grapple. If you want a flying cape style ability, you'll need to build in some way for him to get elevation into the ability since he doesn't have anything else in his kit to do so.
I do think this is the main issue the glide has, being how Warden doesn't have the tools to glide consistently. There are several vantage points on each lane that he could use to his advantage without having to buy Majestic Leap to glide far, but I do agree with you here.
Maybe Warden could get a small bit of vertical height on casting Glide, similar to Ivy's ult (though not nearly as much height)?
 
How about this version?Billowing-Cape-1739388765.png

I added that you don't HAVE to be in the air to activate it, but if you are it reduces the Cooldown. The launch velocity is the same as Lash's Grapple, so it's not crazy high, but it is more than a double jump and can be used in a pinch to get some quick speed and shielding.

I also increased the base cooldown to "pay" the power budget of it being able to come down to a 25s base cooldown if used in the air.
 
How about this version?View attachment 36036

I added that you don't HAVE to be in the air to activate it, but if you are it reduces the Cooldown. The launch velocity is the same as Lash's Grapple, so it's not crazy high, but it is more than a double jump and can be used in a pinch to get some quick speed and shielding.

I also increased the base cooldown to "pay" the power budget of it being able to come down to a 25s base cooldown if used in the air.
if u can cast ability while doing this i'm not vibing, this is basically free majestic leap for warden. it will be insane for warden, specially in this state where warden is overtune
 
if u can cast ability while doing this i'm not vibing, this is basically free majestic leap for warden. it will be insane for warden, specially in this state where warden is overtune
Warden is... Overtuned? He's 8th on current overall winrate and like, 14th in the top bracket. I would argue that, currently, he's in just about the right spot. Maybe even a tiny bit under tuned. Changing his 2 to add in a majestic leap like effect wouldn't push him all that much higher I don't think. Especially since it has the disadvantage that he can't use the movespeed nearly as much in buildings where his ult and Binding Word shine most. Yes, he could rotate and initiate a bit easier, but overall I think this ability would be equiavlent to his current Willpower, not really a buff. If he couldn't use abilities during the glide it would defeat the purpose.
 
Warden is... Overtuned? He's 8th on current overall winrate and like, 14th in the top bracket. I would argue that, currently, he's in just about the right spot. Maybe even a tiny bit under tuned. Changing his 2 to add in a majestic leap like effect wouldn't push him all that much higher I don't think. Especially since it has the disadvantage that he can't use the movespeed nearly as much in buildings where his ult and Binding Word shine most. Yes, he could rotate and initiate a bit easier, but overall I think this ability would be equiavlent to his current Willpower, not really a buff. If he couldn't use abilities during the glide it would defeat the purpose.
Bro, winrate doesn't matter at this point. Haze with new ultimate (update on nov/dec i forgot) for first 2-3 she dominating, RIGHT NOW with no change whatsoever she not in top anymore, this is a fact that WR doesn't matter. In fact, out of nowhere SEVEN has the top WR right now.

You clearly don't know how powerful your suggestion is. You as warden playing in single lane, lets said purple (where the church is). You clear camp behind your shop that in top of building. Pop ur majestic leap, glide to duo lane, activate ur ultimate, throw alchemist and ur cage, ez kill. Powerful rotating ability without no one will knew you will glide there. Imbued this ability with power surge, jesus i can't imagine how strong warden is.

I only agree to this change if you CANNOT active any abilties or items while gliding not even shoot. That would be perfect then. if you want this kind of ability, just pick vindicta or grey talon. There is a reason those two can do that, balance and character design purposes. You basically want warden to fly like sniper and those doesn't fit the character at all.
 
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You as warden playing in single lane, lets said purple (where the church is). You clear camp behind your shop that in top of building. Pop ur majestic leap, glide to duo lane, activate ur ultimate, throw alchemist and ur cage, ez kill. Powerful rotating ability without no one will knew you will glide there.
The thing is, Warden would still need to get into position on a roof to start gliding, which the other team will likely notice his absence and ping it. While Warden is a strong ganker, he's no Lash in terms of burst damage, and people can often react and retreat behind their guardian if they notice Warden coming. I'd go so far as to say we already have this kind of rollout in game, since the jump pad/fan on Amber-Purple that lands on Blue does hypothetically the same thing a Last Stand > Glide would do. Besides, Warden would still have to walk back to his lane, since the glide cooldown is pretty long and he wouldn't have Willpower.

Changing his 2 to add in a majestic leap like effect wouldn't push him all that much higher I don't think.
The main issue with the Majestic Leap/Grapple effect is that Warden can use it in the middle of a fight. Any kind of vertical mobility that doesn't cost stamina is pretty damn strong, especially since Warden is tanky as is. I think it could work, but 20ms of height is a bit much.

I only agree to this change if you CANNOT active any abilties or items while gliding not even shoot. That would be perfect then. if you want this kind of ability, just pick vindicta or grey talon. There is a reason those two can do that, balance and character design purposes. You basically want warden to fly like sniper and those doesn't fit the character at all.
But Warden isn't Vindicta or Talon. A glide can't hover in the air, it has to constantly move in a particular direction. Warden wants to charge at people, because his kit is built around overwhelming enemies up close, and a glide allows him to get close. If he couldn't use abilities or items while gliding, he becomes way worse at initiating fights, which is one of Warden's main strengths and the main selling point of the glide. It does sound intimidating if Warden can channel Last Stand while gliding, but Warden would need to be in a high enough position to fully channel the ult while gliding and he wouldn't be able to use the glide to escape afterwards if he overextends.
I've mentioned the strengths Willpower has, so the goal of the glide concept is to replicate the same benefits in a more interesting way.
 
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