NERF Mcginnis turret

[MissPotato]

So, okay lets focus specifically on the life steal seeing as that is what you're complaining is OP. You had a networth of 19k, with 3.6k unspent. We'll be generous and round up and say you had 16k effective networth. McG had 19k nw with 1.4k unspent. She had an effective 2.2k networth lead over you. So already starting off you're almost an entire t3 item behind.

From the moment you telekinesis you got off (rounded up again to emphasize my the point) 2100 hp of damage. McG, at this point in the game, had 2238 hp. Even rounded up you were still off by 130 damage from killing her before you died. Not including the barrier 300 spirit damage barrier McG has from Enchanters cloak and 100 spirit from superior cooldown. So you were more likely off by about 530 damage.

In that 2100 damage you healed close to 700 hp from just leach alone.

She had Heroic Aura offering her 20% bullet lifesteal. She had enduring spirit giving her 10%, spirit lifesteal giving her 23%,giving her a total of 21% spirit lifesteal (remember diminishing returns.) She then got another 20% against targets effected by soul shredder. (Which is actually only 15.8 again because of dim returns.) Giving her a total of 35.8% spirit lifesteal. During the entire fight she was standing inside Medicinal Scepter giving her 25hp/s she has 27 hp regen from her items and from passive hp/gen from leveling up.

It is much harder to tell how much she healed due to replays not showing the convient green number next to the person's healthbar, but we know she was at full health when tele landed, so we'll take her max HP including bariers subtract your damage, and then take the HP she had when the fight was left over. She had 2638 hp, you did 2100 damage, her expected life would be 538. She ended the fight at 1351 health. Meaning hey, would you look at that she healed for 800 hp. The fight took 4 seconds, scepter and passive regen would heal her over 200 hp but rounded down to make your argument sound stronger. Meaning she life stealed 600 hp.

How much did you life steal for again? Was it 700 hp?

 

[musicbyBoss]

They literally nerfed her turrets last big patch. less uptime, 33% less health, one less charge, do less objective damage, do less creep damage, you're smoking crack if you think that was a buff. The only "buff" was the cooldown reduction, but that was to offset the nerf to uptime, which btw was to designed to nerf the echo shard build. They also nerfed pretty core items to her build because of the Ivy Kudzu bomb build.

It is very clear to me that you have no idea what's going in the game, which is fine not everyone reads the change logs, but you can't expect us to take you seriously if you think the last change to her was a buff. Also NFT bros and not understanding things kinda goes hand in hand.

Yeah cooldown time is a big big buff for annoying things like Turrets - the thing that provide hell of the damage in mid & late game stage. They didn't nerf the damage of Turrets which is a main problem of this topic.
The DPS of turrets is way much bigger than most of Ultimate abilities most of the heroes or their ability damage. There is few hero who can deal the same amount of damage in same aot.
Fixing Echo Shard strat not really solved the problem of damage to hero, rather then avoid pushing full lane in 5 min or take the Mid Boss after 15 min in solo, or any other time in game.
Less one charge of turret mean you will live in fight for 1-2 sec more, or having less on 200hp on each turret not a big deal at all.
Dealing damage to minions like you, and towers not really care me about.
And sorry if my profile pic made you feel like a beggar

 

[MissPotato]

Yeah cooldown time is a big big buff for annoying things like Turrets - the thing that provide hell of the damage in mid & late game stage. They didn't nerf the damage of Turrets which is a main problem of this topic.
The DPS of turrets is way much bigger than most of Ultimate abilities most of the heroes or their ability damage. There is few hero who can deal the same amount of damage in same aot.
Fixing Echo Shard strat not really solved the problem of damage to hero, rather then avoid pushing full lane in 5 min or take the Mid Boss after 15 min in solo, or any other time in game.
Less one charge of turret mean you will live in fight for 1-2 sec more, or having less on 200hp on each turret not a big deal at all.
Dealing damage to minions like you, and towers not really care me about.
And sorry if my profile pic made you feel like a beggar

You do realize that effectively her turrets have the same uptime, because they have 24 second uptime, and 24 second charge restore time, right? Before it was 30 and 30. This is a nerf. Her turrets shoot less shots than they did before, simple as that. They also didn't buff their attack rate. Turrets *claim* to have a dps of 60 up to 105 at max rank. They also scale awfully with spirit with a .4 per spirit. It's actually only 70% of this, because the dps incorrectly assume turrets attack twice per second. but they only attack 1.7 times per second, so the dps is actually 85% of the tooltip says. Meaning it's actually 51 dps and 89.25 dps. Turrets are also effected by damage falloff, to the point at max range their damage drops by around 20%. They also miss a LOT, they have absolutely awful tracking. Again, especially at max range. Against vindicta's, using mystic range they land around 1 in 3 shots.

One less turret means she lost 50% of DPS, without charge upgrades. 33.3% of the dps with extra charge, and 25% of the dps with rapid recharge. It also means she lost more than just 33% of turrets HP. Following the same item pattern, she lost 66.5% turret HP 55.333% with extra charge, and 49.75% hp with rapid restore. Lets not forget that while they HAVE damage falloff, they take FULL damage at any range, so your weapon will do full damage chipping away at them from across the map. If you can't hit a stationary target that's on you. (This also includes ricochet btw)

She isn't geting echo shard in 5 minutes. Lane gives about 6000 souls if you get every single last hit and deny in the entire 9 minute period. She also would have no use for a first item ES, as she needs quite a few other items to make turrets viable.

Yes, she can solo mid. You know who else can? Waith, Haze, Infernus, literally anyone that builds life self sustain. You wanna know why no one, including mcg actually does? Because the boss screams at 60% hp, and if the enemy team sees your team on the map they know you're doing it alone. Soloing mid boss isn't hard. It's dangerous.

Again, it is crystal clear you don't understand this game, or mobas. Which agian, is perfectly fine, but stop acting like you know what you're talking about, just because you *think* a character is OP, because you refuse to buy counter items to deal with them.

If not falling for the popular scam of the week makes me a beggar, I'd rather be a beggar than a NFT bozo.

 

[musicbyBoss]

You do realize that effectively her turrets have the same uptime, because they have 24 second uptime, and 24 second charge restore time, right? Before it was 30 and 30. This is a nerf. Her turrets shoot less shots than they did before, simple as that. They also didn't buff their attack rate. Turrets *claim* to have a dps of 60 up to 105 at max rank. They also scale awfully with spirit with a .4 per spirit. It's actually only 70% of this, because the dps incorrectly assume turrets attack twice per second. but they only attack 1.7 times per second, so the dps is actually 85% of the tooltip says. Meaning it's actually 51 dps and 89.25 dps. Turrets are also effected by damage falloff, to the point at max range their damage drops by around 20%. They also miss a LOT, they have absolutely awful tracking. Again, especially at max range. Against vindicta's, using mystic range they land around 1 in 3 shots.

One less turret means she lost 50% of DPS, without charge upgrades. 33.3% of the dps with extra charge, and 25% of the dps with rapid recharge. It also means she lost more than just 33% of turrets HP. Following the same item pattern, she lost 66.5% turret HP 55.333% with extra charge, and 49.75% hp with rapid restore. Lets not forget that while they HAVE damage falloff, they take FULL damage at any range, so your weapon will do full damage chipping away at them from across the map. If you can't hit a stationary target that's on you. (This also includes ricochet btw)

She isn't geting echo shard in 5 minutes. Lane gives about 6000 souls if you get every single last hit and deny in the entire 9 minute period. She also would have no use for a first item ES, as she needs quite a few other items to make turrets viable.

Yes, she can solo mid. You know who else can? Waith, Haze, Infernus, literally anyone that builds life self sustain. You wanna know why no one, including mcg actually does? Because the boss screams at 60% hp, and if the enemy team sees your team on the map they know you're doing it alone. Soloing mid boss isn't hard. It's dangerous.

Again, it is crystal clear you don't understand this game, or mobas. Which agian, is perfectly fine, but stop acting like you know what you're talking about, just because you *think* a character is OP, because you refuse to buy counter items to deal with them.

If not falling for the popular scam of the week makes me a beggar, I'd rather be a beggar than a NFT bozo.

GOOD MARK FOR YOUR MATH HOMEWORK
Your math knowledge and all this percentages didn’t make any helpful info or solution, you saying the real basic stats which is useless while match is playing cause in game this stats and DPS can move in different ways, someone will rush for Turrets build to be a split-pusher, or someone had a difficult lane and get some items later.
You are talking about thing which nobody even mention: who can take mid boss solo, echo shard and souls on lane(who even ask you about this, no one will rush for echo shard without any other item bruh). You just talking awful thinks just to looks smarter or you like to type a big text work?
The point of all this topic is not about lifesteal, every one knows how to counter it, and more people even know about compound interest of lifesteal reducing.
We here for DPS of this turrets, as I said there is few hero who can deal same amount of DSP by their BASIC ability, and this DPS wasn’t be like this example in video 2k damage in 6 sec at this stage of game.
You saying about counter items, in HS lobbies there is every single game is must have item of Improved Spirit Armour, and there is no q about it. Cause we have this Spirit meta in game, especially when your character having X scaling of Spirit Power.
As I said previously, in mid-late stage of the game, the amount of Damage which McNuggets can provide alone by her Turrets is could be compared to the all summary damage of Spirit Damage by rest of at least 3 teammates. And ISA, will not really save you from this. We can talk about other items that can give you more % of Spirit Resist, but again we faced a problem, that DPS from Turrets + MCG can drop ultimate - that will be a hell of Spirit Damage, especially in team fighting( but not in video rn, there just a 1v1 moment). So no any of Shield, Armour can’t really save you there cause shield will be melted in few seconds, and incoming damage is too strong to reduce it. And I’m not really want to mention all FX which he can provide like Myths Vun, Mystic Slow or anything else that people can buy as a Spirit fx.
Looks like you really envious if my prof pic makes you feels bad, and you want to mention it for no reason. But it’s okay, I understand that typing math thing on forums it’s not what you want to do in you entire life, and seeing how people can do thing what you can not afford makes you irritated.
If you was smarter enough, few years ago things which you like to called scam, can give you good passive income for rest of your life even if NFT is failed after time, there are many thing from this crypto-topic are growth up. But looks you was to way busy by studying math at home. But you can impress people by you math knowledge, hope it’s not your last talent.

 

[why_me1]

GOOD MARK FOR YOUR MATH HOMEWORK
Your math knowledge and all this percentages didn’t make any helpful info or solution, you saying the real basic stats which is useless while match is playing cause in game this stats and DPS can move in different ways, someone will rush for Turrets build to be a split-pusher, or someone had a difficult lane and get some items later.
You are talking about thing which nobody even mention: who can take mid boss solo, echo shard and souls on lane(who even ask you about this, no one will rush for echo shard without any other item bruh). You just talking awful thinks just to looks smarter or you like to type a big text work?
The point of all this topic is not about lifesteal, every one knows how to counter it, and more people even know about compound interest of lifesteal reducing.
We here for DPS of this turrets, as I said there is few hero who can deal same amount of DSP by their BASIC ability, and this DPS wasn’t be like this example in video 2k damage in 6 sec at this stage of game.
You saying about counter items, in HS lobbies there is every single game is must have item of Improved Spirit Armour, and there is no q about it. Cause we have this Spirit meta in game, especially when your character having X scaling of Spirit Power.
As I said previously, in mid-late stage of the game, the amount of Damage which McNuggets can provide alone by her Turrets is could be compared to the all summary damage of Spirit Damage by rest of at least 3 teammates. And ISA, will not really save you from this. We can talk about other items that can give you more % of Spirit Resist, but again we faced a problem, that DPS from Turrets + MCG can drop ultimate - that will be a hell of Spirit Damage, especially in team fighting( but not in video rn, there just a 1v1 moment). So no any of Shield, Armour can’t really save you there cause shield will be melted in few seconds, and incoming damage is too strong to reduce it. And I’m not really want to mention all FX which he can provide like Myths Vun, Mystic Slow or anything else that people can buy as a Spirit fx.
Looks like you really envious if my prof pic makes you feels bad, and you want to mention it for no reason. But it’s okay, I understand that typing math thing on forums it’s not what you want to do in you entire life, and seeing how people can do thing what you can not afford makes you irritated.
If you was smarter enough, few years ago things which you like to called scam, can give you good passive income for rest of your life even if NFT is failed after time, there are many thing from this crypto-topic are growth up. But looks you was to way busy by studying math at home. But you can impress people by you math knowledge, hope it’s not your last talent.

You said the turrets got buffed, math proofs you wrong it was a overall nerf. Only buff was the quicker deploy time.

And as was said many times before, yes they deal good damage, but they have limited range, poor aim, cant move, low health, take full dmg at every distance. You have to actively run into them and if you do, its your fault.

What MissPotato also didn't mention the attack speed of the turrets is capped at about 2x of the base turrets 1.6/s including the buff from T2, so healing and heroic aura don't show their full potential.

One point I am with you, we currently have too high spirit dmg in the meta and this is a problem because the items to counter it are limited and the dmg dealt is too high.
Its hard to get above 50% spirit resist while 70-80% bullet resist are no issue. On top of that there are items like Escalating exposure for spirit while there is nothing comparable for guns.

Since you went into the replay you probably seen the other clip of the exact thing happening at 22 minutes.

Just checked it. You did the same thing. Pushed into a nest of her turrets expecting a different outcome than the one before. You also used the same items, while McGinnis improved her items. Mystic vulnerability and suppressor increased her dmg and lowered your dmg.

Spirit resist and Ricochet counter her turret build very effectively. If you get toxic bullets or healbane on top you shut her down completely. Then only the stun from her wall can safe her.

 

[kbmg95]

You said the turrets got buffed, math proofs you wrong it was a overall nerf. Only buff was the quicker deploy time.

And as was said many times before, yes they deal good damage, but they have limited range, poor aim, cant move, low health, take full dmg at every distance. You have to actively run into them and if you do, its your fault.

What MissPotato also didn't mention the attack speed of the turrets is capped at about 2x of the base turrets 1.6/s including the buff from T2, so healing and heroic aura don't show their full potential.

One point I am with you, we currently have too high spirit dmg in the meta and this is a problem because the items to counter it are limited and the dmg dealt is too high.
Its hard to get above 50% spirit resist while 70-80% bullet resist are no issue. On top of that there are items like Escalating exposure for spirit while there is nothing comparable for guns.


Just checked it. You did the same thing. Pushed into a nest of her turrets expecting a different outcome than the one before. You also used the same items, while McGinnis improved her items. Mystic vulnerability and suppressor increased her dmg and lowered your dmg.

Spirit resist and Ricochet counter her turret build very effectively. If you get toxic bullets or healbane on top you shut her down completely. Then only the stun from her wall can safe her.

All good, i was up for 25 hours thinking i could play, I just still dont understand how turrets can do so much damage. Ill just use shadow weave instead and sneak up on someone without their turrets lol. I also updated my build the one i was using yesterday kind of does suck. Bullet life steal is way better and cheaper than leach and i can farm jungle camps with that.

 

[xyi]

skill issue

 

[kbmg95]

skill issue

may the be so, but still the turrets needs to be nerfed.

 

[DMT]

You can't tell me a single turret that wasn't buffed in any way doing this much damage is balanced.

 

[MissPotato]

You can't tell me a single turret that wasn't buffed in any way doing this much damage is balanced.

View attachment 25903

Being generous and pretending like you were standing still, directly in front of the turret, AND they fixed the bug that causes turrets to shoot slower than they should (thus reducing their DPS) you would have to stood in the turrets range for 22 seconds to take that much damage from an "unbuffed" turret. But considering you had 2,610 health on Haze (maybe including lifesteal), and cropping the entire rest of the game out, I highly doubt you're being genuine.

What is more likely is the McG was stacking turrets directly ontop of each other (if you're even telling the truth about that), which I would agree needs to be fixed.

 

[hellduke]

It's not just life steel. She has her heal down which heals for 5% of her max HP in addition to the lifesteal. The turrets are easy to kill and if you focus down the turrets first (which are much easier to deal with even in bulk now that ricochet bounces off them) Mcguiniss herself with a turret focus will not be able to do much on her own.

This is a character that is not really that great and will typically get trounced by a competent Wraith not to mention most characters will be able to deal with Mcginnis provided they don't just ignore the turrets like idiots and try to rush down the character