Hero - WICKERMAN

[nathanieljbrill]

Thanks for taking the time to reply with so much work put in.

Wickerman's Role
I have to say that a lot of these suggestions would make Wickerman much less of a frontliner. Losing the axe chop from Forest Thinning makes him much less of a threat close up. Replacing it with tree chopping also makes him thematically much less maniacal and freaky. The idea with the name and theme of the ability is that he treats you like a tree that needs chopping. Also losing the Flare up effect from Wickerman's ultimate Scorched Earth again makes him much less of a frontliner, losing the upclose retaliation damage and the heal it provides.

I'm also not a fan of removing Sizzle as a mechanic as I think it has potential for interesting interplay with his kit (alt fire and fire grenade). How sizzle interracts and what its exact effect is I'm still down to consider changes on.

On "Fire Grenade"
Also changing the fire fighter equipment "fire grenade" and replacing it with a generic fire explosion (which seems like what you're suggesting) seems a shame to me, it would take away from his themes and identity.


On "Burning Tree"
The burning tree idea is interesting but sounds very clunky to use, a lot of set up and requiring enemies to stay put in the same place for a fairly long time, without a kit that has any CC.

What I definetly will consider though, is the idea of having an ability replaced with a different one, as part of a "combo ability."

I did have some ideas before posting Wickerman's kit to the forums. Where I wanted him to chop the spectral trees in his ult for some effect, be it healing or damage, but it all seemed too clunky or overcomplicated.

On "Engulfed in Flame"
I don't have much to say here except that I'm not a fan. The idea of Schorched Earth is to basically become a raid boss for a duration within his own territory. Where fighting him is dangerous. Engulfed Flame seems to me to be just for his own fire power with not much going on.

Closing thoughts
I haven't added any upgrades (T1,T2,T3 AP upgrades) yet so I appreciate the ideas you give here, I'll see what I'll land on in the end there.

Even though I don't agree with much of what you suggested, I appreciate that you took the time and show interest! Thanks again!

Your current abilities are not those of a frontliner. My ability suggestions are much more frontliny. Though their specifically more tanky in the sense of area denial.

The only frontlining ability I see in the current kit is the ultimate (but the ultimate is restricted to an area so it also functions as area denial).

Making the grenade create fire doesn't take away from his identity unless the other fire creating abilities do. If we have to choose between creating or fighting fire then creating fire seems more in line with your concept. The grenade also is meant to provide an alternate bullet procing effect to Sizzle. As it stands Sizzle is the worst offender of crazy poke damage in lane. There just can't be an ability that does that in the laning stage. The sizzle mechanic with his 1 seems overly complicated to accomplish things too. They sizzle and then your grenade does more damage... which is then converted to a damage amp... so you need to use more abilities to take advantage of that damage amp. No other character has a 2 step process to create a damage amp and for good reason. The amp would have to be extremely large to make that practical in which case it becomes a balancing nightmare.

The burning tree doesn't require the enemy to stay in place. The burning tree functions as an effective area denial. The advantage of it is that it lasts 30s and creates that burning area. You also can choose to drop the tree at any point and are free to use the axe ability through the duration. Think of it as your axe ability but with greater variety and area denial.

That burning area created by the tree also works with his passive from his ult. He can stand invisibly in the flaming tree area. This makes him hard to approach and makes him an effective frontliner through his area denial methods.

Engulfed Flame creates many of these areas (even on the opponent) that he can be invisible in. He uses area denial that allows him to take aggressive positioning. (Though i already think that the spirit scaling damage for the ult is too high.)

I would say that the current abilities don't have any synergy in them as well. They just don't seem related to each other. All 4 abilities coordinate in the suggested abilities.

If you want him to be tankier I think the suggested abilities would be better modified to fit that desire than the current abilities.

 

[gustavnis]

Your current abilities are not those of a frontliner. My ability suggestions are much more frontliny. Though their specifically more tanky in the sense of area denial.

The only frontlining ability I see in the current kit is the ultimate (but the ultimate is restricted to an area so it also functions as area denial).

Making the grenade create fire doesn't take away from his identity unless the other fire creating abilities do. If we have to choose between creating or fighting fire then creating fire seems more in line with your concept. The grenade also is meant to provide an alternate bullet procing effect to Sizzle. As it stands Sizzle is the worst offender of crazy poke damage in lane. There just can't be an ability that does that in the laning stage. The sizzle mechanic with his 1 seems overly complicated to accomplish things too. They sizzle and then your grenade does more damage... which is then converted to a damage amp... so you need to use more abilities to take advantage of that damage amp. No other character has a 2 step process to create a damage amp and for good reason. The amp would have to be extremely large to make that practical in which case it becomes a balancing nightmare.

The burning tree doesn't require the enemy to stay in place. The burning tree functions as an effective area denial. The advantage of it is that it lasts 30s and creates that burning area. You also can choose to drop the tree at any point and are free to use the axe ability through the duration. Think of it as your axe ability but with greater variety and area denial.

That burning area created by the tree also works with his passive from his ult. He can stand invisibly in the flaming tree area. This makes him hard to approach and makes him an effective frontliner through his area denial methods.

Engulfed Flame creates many of these areas (even on the opponent) that he can be invisible in. He uses area denial that allows him to take aggressive positioning. (Though i already think that the spirit scaling damage for the ult is too high.)

I would say that the current abilities don't have any synergy in them as well. They just don't seem related to each other. All 4 abilities coordinate in the suggested abilities.

If you want him to be tankier I think the suggested abilities would be better modified to fit that desire than the current abilities.

If you read the overview of Wickerman's peronality you would see that he toys with fire, lighting things on fire is just as fun for him as exstinguishing it, and repeating the process. It's not a choice between the two.

When I say front liner I mean a close combat fairly durable hero, not necessarily a tank or CC unit like say Abrams. Maybe I should have said brawler instead?

With the fire grenade damage amp, the idea was for Wickerman to provide damage for his entire team, the amp is for all damage taken. It also applies in an AoE provided the water splash hits multiple enemies with Sizzle. This would make him a bit more of a team player, rather than a selfish hero which I like the idea of. And to be able to apply such a powerful amp I think it would be far too strong if it was easilly applied.


Here's how I see his current kit to fit together:

You throw down Scorched Earth in a team fight, they now all have Sizzle constantly being applied. You stand close to the enemies, throw your grenade with Fire Fighting and follow up with an axe swing. If they flee you use your Spontaneous Combustion to catch up. All while being temporarily tankier and Flaring up with damage around you if you get shot.

I'm sure there are holes in the plan that would need fixing / adjusting. But to say there is no synnergy seems very far fetched

Edit: I forgot to mention about the laning phase. If it was the case that Sizzle was too strong in the laning phase, then the % damage could simply be lower at lower Ability tiers. Say 2% damage instead of 4%.

Also your suggested burning tree that stays on the ground for 30sec has a lot of problems. Not the least of which is to throw it in the middle of your lane, killing troopers for a whole 30 seconds. It could also be thrown onto shops, mid boss crystal, friendly and enemy guardians. I just think an ability that denies an area for such a long time is a huge issue

 

[nathanieljbrill]

If you read the overview of Wickerman's peronality you would see that he toys with fire, lighting things on fire is just as fun for him as exstinguishing it, and repeating the process. It's not a choice between the two.

When I say front liner I mean a close combat fairly durable hero, not necessarily a tank or CC unit like say Abrams. Maybe I should have said brawler instead?

With the fire grenade damage amp, the idea was for Wickerman to provide damage for his entire team, the amp is for all damage taken. It also applies in an AoE provided the water splash hits multiple enemies with Sizzle. This would make him a bit more of a team player, rather than a selfish hero which I like the idea of. And to be able to apply such a powerful amp I think it would be far too strong if it was easilly applied.


Here's how I see his current kit to fit together:

You throw down Scorched Earth in a team fight, they now all have Sizzle constantly being applied. You stand close to the enemies, throw your grenade with Fire Fighting and follow up with an axe swing. If they flee you use your Spontaneous Combustion to catch up. All while being temporarily tankier and Flaring up with damage around you if you get shot.

I'm sure there are holes in the plan that would need fixing / adjusting. But to say there is no synnergy seems very far fetched

Edit: I forgot to mention about the laning phase. If it was the case that Sizzle was too strong in the laning phase, then the % damage could simply be lower at lower Ability tiers. Say 2% damage instead of 4%.

Also your suggested burning tree that stays on the ground for 30sec has a lot of problems. Not the least of which is to throw it in the middle of your lane, killing troopers for a whole 30 seconds. It could also be thrown onto shops, mid boss crystal, friendly and enemy guardians. I just think an ability that denies an area for such a long time is a huge issue

It's default DPS is 10 so it isn't that effective at trooper clearing. Certainly not as effective as a single kudzu bomb. Enemy guardians will break it with a punch (included in description). If it needs height to pop up and fall over shops will be protected. Don't see how mid boss crystal would be a concern.

 

[gustavnis]

It's default DPS is 10 so it isn't that effective at trooper clearing. Certainly not as effective as a single kudzu bomb. Enemy guardians will break it with a punch (included in description). If it needs height to pop up and fall over shops will be protected. Don't see how mid boss crystal would be a concern.

Ah, I didn't look very closely on individual damage numbers. I also misunderstood what you meant by trees being breakable by enemies. I thought you meant before the tree was cut/burning. It honestly seems very weak fi you can break it, though perhaps it could have a decent amount of HP.

It's a cool concept for an ability. I just wouldn't put it on Wickerman. He already has area denial with his ultimate, and the ability would feel pretty redundant to use within the ult zone

 

[nathanieljbrill]

Ah, I didn't look very closely on individual damage numbers. I also misunderstood what you meant by trees being breakable by enemies. I thought you meant before the tree was cut/burning. It honestly seems very weak fi you can break it, though perhaps it could have a decent amount of HP.

It's a cool concept for an ability. I just wouldn't put it on Wickerman. He already has area denial with his ultimate, and the ability would feel pretty redundant to use within the ult zone

Only objectives can break it.

 

[gustavnis]

Only objectives can break it.

Oh, my bad. Again haha

 

[Kardiiacc]

Your art is so beautiful its making me cry

 

[gustavnis]

Your art is so beautiful its making me cry

Haha, thank you! (sorry for making you cry :c)

 

[Gutszen]

it would be really nice to have a kind of skillshot gun.

 

[gustavnis]

it would be really nice to have a kind of skillshot gun.

Same I like the idea of some guns having unique interractions with stats too. Like the max ammo becoming projectile size. Something I'll explore more in future characters

 

[AlmightyChaos]

No cause for alarm, but, uhh.. we both now have heroes with ults that have a same name, yours and mine!

 

[gustavnis]

No cause for alarm, but, uhh.. we both now have heroes with ults that have a same name, yours and mine!

I mean, "scorched earth" is a well known concept and a saying. So yeah that's not too surprising

 

[AlmightyChaos]

I mean, "scorched earth" is a well known concept and a saying. So yeah that's not too surprising

No worries, already renamed mine into something else, so as to avoid any confusion