Punched Mid-Parry

[Tinkerer_Red]

I have a clip showing the issues with server latency and parries.

Getting punched in a parry - Clipped with Medal.tv

Watch Getting punched in a parry and millions of other Deadlock videos captured using Medal.

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In the clip I knew the mirage was going to try to jump me as he had already seen me there for a little while denying souls. I expected him to get greedy and punch me so I was baiting it out of him for a free kill. However I hear him walking up, know it's coming, parry just as he starts his heavy melee, and get punched in the middle of my parry animation. Still taking damage.

Normally I'll double check if my parry was maybe a frame or two off, but this here has no excuse, even for server latency which i believe was only 30ms (given i was able to deny souls at all)


Parries should not be predicted by the server, then should be client sided with server validation so specifically this never happens. The client would send a packet saying a successful parry has occurred, then the server would check the latency, the lag compensation, and the timestamp of the packet to ensure that it was indeed a successful parry. With how the current parry implementation works its so extremely common to second guess if you actually did parry someone, and for players with a bad connection this means an entire feature set of the game is locked of from them. Which would single handedly give melee builds a relatively high "buff" simply because the victims cant actually parry in time physically due to the current implementation.

I have worked on systems like this before where it's player to player timed reactions, and this is the standard way of doing it. If you're like further proof anyone who has played TF2 or Darksouls online will know about the problems with face stabs. They should be victims side, with server validation, sometimes this means that the attacker will have a few frames of successful hit, but the animation and audio which still played for a parry would indicate it clearly. its a known risk you might be parried, its not exactly a known risk your parry might be completely meaningless opening you up to further punches, additional damage from weapons and abilities while you are standing still.

 

[Rizzrick]

You had over 100ms ping. It shows in the top right corner. Considering your latency the parry was just too late.

I'm sure it can be improved like you've touched on, and it probably will, like soul secures/denies (which have a 140ms buffer now). But I wouldn't call this a bug. Playing high reaction online competitive games will just never be optimal with high ping.

 

[Tinkerer_Red]

Ah you're right I totally missed out on that. though even with that in mind 140ms of ping is still only 0.14 seconds, the parry animation is clearly shown to be with in those acceptable deviations. Though as a network developer I strongly disagree with the reasoning that this isnt a bug, there is a solved solution to this which can be implemented. It's the same solution movement is already using, client sided, server validated. more then just movement the same is true for shooting, the number of times being shot just barely around a wall is explicitly this practice in play. The parry being the only thing I've noticed which doesnt abide by this ruleset would surely be considered a bug.

 

[Rizzrick]

IMO being shot barely around a wall is an example of this practice NOT being in play. If it was, your client would tell the server that you were behind cover and the hit wouldn't register. But that wouldn't be very fair to the shooter who hit the shot on their client. And the same applies to melees and parries, if on your end you land your melee, and then somehow get parried AFTER your hit lands, that wouldn't feel very good.

If someone must have some desync of events, it should be the player with high ping, not the one with low ping. And I say that as someone who plays on 140ms ping consistently.

 

[Tinkerer_Red]

Well the same logic applies to the inverse having high ping means you have a greater chance of punching someone because your animation could fully finish before the server even hears you are punching. The logic there simply doesnt follow.

 

[Rizzrick]

Huh? When you melee on high ping, the hit point is sent to the server, and you only know if it succeeded 100ms or whatever your ping is later. If the enemy parries and their parry hits the server before your melee, you will get parried, even if you only see their parry after your animation finishes. So no, you definitely don't have a greater chance of punching someone if you have high ping. You have about the same chance, but a bit less time to react to a parry and redirect your heavy melee.