Debuff Remover should purge some positive effects too

[qbWithYou]

It's common to buy Knockdown against flying characters, but if enemies see it, they buy Debuff Remover which not only purges knockdown, but also doesn't interrupt flying, which in my opinion, is the most frustrating part especially if you are in the losing team and buying other items like Curse is close to impossible.

 

[rax the asshole]

item name says it all - "debuff remover" xd it is to remove negative effects, not positive ones. when your buying items to counter your enemies (like knockdown for vindicta or ethereal shift for lash) and they can get over it by buying other items, that's how it works

 

[thatfunkedude]

positive effects aren't a debuff, therefore they aren't removed.

 

[qbWithYou]

Folks, I see your point, but there should be some trade-offs. For example, metal skin protects you from bullet damage, but it slows you, and bullets can still proc effects.

Now, let's have a look at the Debuff Remover, which passively decreases debuffs duration by 40%, purges all the negative effects applied to you, and in the case of purging effects, you get movement speed and health restored.

Isn't it too much value for a 3k item?

 

[swanne]

wouldn't say so myself, you have to remember that ccs are balanced off the fact that they can either be canceled or not
for example, a high cost/high risk cc like dynamo ult can not be affected by debuff remover but a low effort + high value stun like vindicta stake and knockdown can be reduced by debuff reduction and cleansed by remover
i'd say its enough value as a "3k" (4250, actually) tier 3 item, considering that most ccs in this game are punishment for bad positioning and it doesnt really make you any stronger, its just a win-more item and usually debuff reducer itself is enough value compared to remover itself
you only really consider something like remover when against debuff menaces like pocket, infernus or if you're easily getting countered with knockdown like vindicta
besides, you can counter vindicta with stuff like better positioning/taking better fights and if she gets debuff remover the team could just get another knockdown, its not as if knockdown is a low value / counter-specific item anyways

 

[thatfunkedude]

Folks, I see your point, but there should be some trade-offs. For example, metal skin protects you from bullet damage, but it slows you, and bullets can still proc effects.

Now, let's have a look at the Debuff Remover, which passively decreases debuffs duration by 40%, purges all the negative effects applied to you, and in the case of purging effects, you get movement speed and health restored.

Isn't it too much value for a 3k item?

No, because it has very little utility outside of its specific purpose of purging debuff effects.

 

[Rosgath]

No, because it has very little utility outside of its specific purpose of purging debuff effects.

Debuff effects which basically every hero has and are often essential to their kits.

There's ALWAYS a way to make use of debuff remover. Fighting Geist? Purge her malice stacks when you think she's going to try to go in for the kill. Fighting Shiv? pop it to clear his bleeds. Even Abrams (who has barely any debuffs to speak of) wants a debuff reducer to make it easier to parry him after he charges and stuns you. It can even be useful to clear things like Healbane/toxic bullets/Leech if you really need the healing in a tight spot.

Debuff reducer/remover is honestly one of the less situational pickups that I see often in the "situational" sections of builds.

All that said, I don't think it should remove beneficial effects like flight. It doesn't make sense with the item and, quite frankly, debuff remover is a counter pick. It doesn't need drawbacks like Metal Skin does (which before it's nerf could be used as an initiation tool).

 

[thatfunkedude]

Debuff effects which basically every hero has and are often essential to their kits.

There's ALWAYS a way to make use of debuff remover. Fighting Geist? Purge her malice stacks when you think she's going to try to go in for the kill. Fighting Shiv? pop it to clear his bleeds. Even Abrams (who has barely any debuffs to speak of) wants a debuff reducer to make it easier to parry him after he charges and stuns you. It can even be useful to clear things like Healbane/toxic bullets/Leech if you really need the healing in a tight spot.

Debuff reducer/remover is honestly one of the less situational pickups that I see often in the "situational" sections of builds.

All that said, I don't think it should remove beneficial effects like flight. It doesn't make sense with the item and, quite frankly, debuff remover is a counter pick. It doesn't need drawbacks like Metal Skin does (which before it's nerf could be used as an initiation tool).

There is always a use for debuff remover, but the use-case of debuff remover specifically only applies to fighting debuff kits and items. You would rarely ever rush debuff-remover against a low-debuff comp because even if they're buying debuff procs, they aren't going to be proccing for large until lategame anyways. while 3k may be "cheap", that is because it should be accessible near midgame when fighting heroes like bebop and seven but this low cost is offset by the fact that against any other non-debuff comps, you have very little reason to buy remover anywhere before 20 minutes in as opposed to just buying reducer.