6,300-9,800 "Sniper"

cznono1

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As someone who enjoys long-range marksmen in other mobas, I feel like the gun damage ranged options are a little lackluster. I would love to see a T3 item that extends Sharpshooter's "+15% Fall-off Range" even further. I'm talking somewhere in the range of +50-100% Fall-off Range, if not removing the restriction entirely. With the tight angles / corridors throughout most of the map, I don't think it would be too unbalanced, but let me know your thoughts.
 
I feel like it should have some sort of tradeoff, like reduced close ranged damage if it gives that big of a benefit.
 
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Game isnt made for long range and specifically lessen damage with distance heavily, every sniper or camper is a hassle to balance, you cant get to him with conventional means, he will always escape, and other means are just annoying to do and they still have a room or time for long range guy to get away, defeats whole point of the game right now. You will get invisible people + snipers or artillery spam. Whole melee or mages wont be playable without items that grant invisibility or other means to creep up on people.
 
Game isnt made for long range and specifically lessen damage with distance heavily, every sniper or camper is a hassle to balance, you cant get to him with conventional means, he will always escape, and other means are just annoying to do and they still have a room or time for long range guy to get away, defeats whole point of the game right now. You will get invisible people + snipers or artillery spam. Whole melee or mages wont be playable without items that grant invisibility or other means to creep up on people.
Nah, Vindicta and Talon are in the bottom 3 of winrates. Sharpshooter currently has the lowest Weapon Tier-3 item winrate, and it's in the bottom 5 worst-performing items overrall. Its literally a waste of time shooting people once falloff kicks in, especially once the enemy starts building bullet armor / shields.

For example, This is where Vindicta's base falloff starts
falloff1.png

And this is where her falloff starts with Sharpshooter.falloff2.png
The bonus damage from Sharpshooter is in between these 2 spots, decidedly very mid-range. Vindicta is extremely squishy and a lot of heroes can cross this distance easily, especially if she gets slowed.

The close range heroes are already very strong, one long-range upgrade isn't going to break the game.
 
Nah, Vindicta and Talon are in the bottom 3 of winrates. Sharpshooter currently has the lowest Weapon Tier-3 item winrate, and it's in the bottom 5 worst-performing items overrall. Its literally a waste of time shooting people once falloff kicks in, especially once the enemy starts building bullet armor / shields.

For example, This is where Vindicta's base falloff starts
View attachment 15940

And this is where her falloff starts with Sharpshooter.View attachment 15939
The bonus damage from Sharpshooter is in between these 2 spots, decidedly very mid-range. Vindicta is extremely squishy and a lot of heroes can cross this distance easily, especially if she gets slowed.

The close range heroes are already very strong, one long-range upgrade isn't going to break the game.
dawg you want long range to be playable, normal and others do not, talon and vindicta are low wr's because of other reasons. Wait until they fix them and dont complain about not being able to snipe people or oneshot them without being whooped into oblivion. Im glad that this game doesnt appreciate long range battles as they are random and not tactical at all. Also most of the items are not usable, since they testing game and build is in alpha. Build her into spirit and do hit and run with stealth item as smart people do on her. This item is just to give a little more damage to certain heroes in specific circumstances, like her second ability, you will always have max or beyond max range, and she isnt building bullet damage mainly, so your point are not valid. Snipers in this game will ruin whole concept, imagine you can stay behind your guardian and just chilly willy hit creeps and then farm neutrals, all without risk or harass, pretty fun. Then you snowball and oneshot people from distances game not rendering, really fun and interactive.
p.s. i looked your screen, it is a heavy melee attack range or difference, yikes. really not a single point of buying that item right? (sarcasm)
 
dawg you want long range to be playable, normal and others do not, talon and vindicta are low wr's because of other reasons. Wait until they fix them and dont complain about not being able to snipe people or oneshot them without being whooped into oblivion. Im glad that this game doesnt appreciate long range battles as they are random and not tactical at all. Also most of the items are not usable, since they testing game and build is in alpha. Build her into spirit and do hit and run with stealth item as smart people do on her. This item is just to give a little more damage to certain heroes in specific circumstances, like her second ability, you will always have max or beyond max range, and she isnt building bullet damage mainly, so your point are not valid. Snipers in this game will ruin whole concept, imagine you can stay behind your guardian and just chilly willy hit creeps and then farm neutrals, all without risk or harass, pretty fun. Then you snowball and oneshot people from distances game not rendering, really fun and interactive.
p.s. i looked your screen, it is a heavy melee attack range or difference, yikes. really not a single point of buying that item right? (sarcasm)
Was this insulting tone productive? Is it adding value to the discussion? Apologies for the rhetorical question, but yeah, if you want people to listen to your input and value your opinion, it might help to rethink your approach. Just my 2 cents.
 
Im not against this item, but I also think it has no place in the game.
Currently the distance you can snipe at is quite limited, and a lot already gets covered by existing items.
It also does not help in the dynamic of the game to have someone as far back as possible who is sniping.
Sharpshooter turns the damage falloff range of 25meters into 35meters, this could be improved to 45meters but i would not go further than that.
If a player realy realy wants to snipe, you can do so with Mystic Shot and building spirit damage. But that does mean being away from your lane and not helping teammates.
 
Was this insulting tone productive? Is it adding value to the discussion? Apologies for the rhetorical question, but yeah, if you want people to listen to your input and value your opinion, it might help to rethink your approach. Just my 2 cents.
If someones gets his way, you will then be in my place, or enjoying this funny circus ride of gameplay thats going to happen. Long range always unfun. You dont need a wall of text to get that, try thinking.
 
there are two sides to good game design, is it fun to play, and is it fun to play against?

in reality more people play against a character than plays the character, and likely more people play against an item than play with the item, so in that sense its more important to make sure its fun to play against than fun to play.

would it be fun to play against people who have no damage fall off and stay so far away you yourself cant damage them?
no, it would not.

thats really all there is to this. the idea is unfun for everyone but the person using it, therefore it is a bad idea.
 
there are two sides to good game design, is it fun to play, and is it fun to play against?

in reality more people play against a character than plays the character, and likely more people play against an item than play with the item, so in that sense its more important to make sure its fun to play against than fun to play.

would it be fun to play against people who have no damage fall off and stay so far away you yourself cant damage them?
no, it would not.

thats really all there is to this. the idea is unfun for everyone but the person using it, therefore it is a bad idea.
This is known to everyone who played a game where a big iron can one shot people through armor from far away. I dont know why it came to you explaining nicely, like its kinda obvious. Anyway a valid opinion unlike ranting on how it should be in a game, or how you should sugarcoat and explain it in detail.
 
would it be fun to play against people who have no damage fall off and stay so far away you yourself cant damage them?
no, it would not.
There's already plenty of bullshit that feels terrible to play against in Deadlock, the point of it being a MOBA is you can always itemize with your own bullshit to adapt. You're acting like items and strategy don't exist.

I completely understand your reasoning, but I actually think it would be such a nothingburger in Deadlock, unless the item completely removed fall-off, which I wouldn't support.
 
There's already plenty of bullshit that feels terrible to play against in Deadlock, the point of it being a MOBA is you can always itemize with your own bullshit to adapt. You're acting like items and strategy don't exist.

I completely understand your reasoning, but I actually think it would be such a nothingburger in Deadlock, unless the item completely removed fall-off, which I wouldn't support.
Most bs out there is paywalled at tier 4. and you only need tier 3 or 2 to completely counter it. Right now its pretty good if you ofc aware of enemies and not just droning for whole game.
 
Most bs out there is paywalled at tier 4. and you only need tier 3 or 2 to completely counter it. Right now its pretty good if you ofc aware of enemies and not just droning for whole game.
Right, like the proposed item being a tier 4 upgrade to Sharpshooter, and all you need to counter a Vindicta or Talon with Sharpshooter is knock-down...

But there's plenty of bullshit that isn't gated at Tier 4.
 
Right, like the proposed item being a tier 4 upgrade to Sharpshooter, and all you need to counter a Vindicta or Talon with Sharpshooter is knock-down...

But there's plenty of bullshit that isn't gated at Tier 4.
They have no follow or finisher, lmao. If you dont need to kill them right now and there. You just press metal skin or ethereal after dropping all your stamina, then dip again and there you go. They are on foot after that. You do the killing or just leave them be, then take another fight.
If they are in your base, they cant simply fly out, space is confined. they will have to pass through accessible by foot areas and then you whoop them. Not to mention almost every character have gap closer to them even while they are flying or simply shoot them down. Flying is a position thing not invincibility. Even if you by some crazy chance dont have anything of above, or not willing to do anything of above. You can buy items to counter flying state, not limited to knockdown.
 
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